I posted this question a few days ago, but see that I replied to a different thread.  I'm repeating it here to begin a new thread regarding tie up of the countermarche loom.

I'm continuing to have issues with my tie up. 

Sara, I'm not sure what you mean by a "plain" tie up, because the only way I have ever done it is by following the article that Madelyn posted. Is there some other reference that will give me more information?

I'm finding that when I take the peg out of the top of the loom, and the shafts hang in the neutral position, the front 4 tend to rest on the loom.  The back ones hang, about 1/2 inch from the body of the loom.  I think this is part of my problem because when the shafts are lowered, they don't have any tension on them, which allows the heddles to move around and cross over the ones that are next to them.  But for the life of me I can't figure out how to eliminate this.

I'm not sure how to adjust the lams so that don't either move up or down so much. 

Again, any help is certainly welcomed.

Janene

 

just finished a warp from hell and am making peace with the loom.  To help with the healing process, I retied the whole works, starting with the article by Madelyn.  I followed it to the letter.  But I'm still having some trouble with getting the lowered warp threads to be even.  The problem seems to be that the bar holding the bottom of the heddles that raise go up higher than the eye of the heddles that lower, lifting some of the lowered warp threads.  This is especially a problem when there are lowered shafts in both the back and the front of the loom (say shafts 7. 6 and 1 are lowered- 7 and 6 will have interference from the other shafts but shaft 1 won't).  I'm not sure how to fix this.

Also, some of the treadles touch the floor and others don't.  I can't figure out the variable that changes that.

 

T

Sara von Tresckow's picture POST# 12    Posted by Sara von Tresckow 2 days ago - 01/13/2010

 Jeanne

You have a couple of things here:

1. That article of Madelyn's has an extremely large shed, perhaps too extreme - it may well be that your shed exceeds the length of your heddles. If the lower shaft bars are bringing up the lowered threads, even by a little, you need to adjust your shed a tad smaller so that the lower shaft bars are not coming up as far. Actually, if you skip the elastics and odd lam angles and simply do a plain Jane countermarche tieup using the pegs at the lams and go for a more "normal" shed height you should be just fine.

The article you reference is based on Texsolv 330/12 heddles where most countermarche looms in cicrulation have 280/12. Remember, too, the working shed height is where you insert your shuttle after pushing the overhead beater back. If you make ANY shed too extreme, you are putting excessive pressure on your warp that is not really needed.

2. As long as you get your shed floor adjusted, where the treadle stops is actually of little importance. I generally have mine adjusted so that they do not dome all the way to the floor and stop pressing when the shed has opened sufficiently to pass the shuttle.

Comments

Sat, 07/27/2013 - 19:53

Sara von Tresckow

If your loom has 8 shafts, you are correct that there is only one psoition. On the 4 shaft models, you have a choice about hanging those 4 either to the front or back of the box on top.

The Bexell Cranbrook is one of the finest rug looms ever built. Saarinen designed it for his wife who did massiv Rya rugs - hence the locking treadles to allow the loom to operate much the same as the Rio Grande or Oaxacan walking rug looms. I have never had issues getting good tension on mine, but you do need to pay attention that you have woven far enough before advancing or your beater does not make contact with the fell line.

The best way to test your ideas is to put a smallish warp on your loom and see how it performs. That way if you adjust something, like the height of the beater, you can see right away what the effect is.

This adventure will more resemble your Cello playing than engineering. Written by someone married to a German mechanical engineer for the last 42 years. If he makes a textile tool, it gets tested by a weaver first because his engineering thoughts sometimes lead to unworkable solutions.

Sat, 07/27/2013 - 22:41

jander14indoor (not verified)

Thanks Sara, that makes sense on the positions now.  For future reference (since I don't always have to use all 8 shafts), what circumstances would have me move it to the forward or rear position?  I assume for everyday stuff the forward position is fine since that's where it goes with 8 shafts.

 

About my Cello playing, I'm a FAR better engineer than Cellist, and perhaps very like your husband.  I'm the loom mechanic as well as weaver and you can guess (being married to an engineer as you said) I always want to make things "better", sometimes at the expense of good enough...

 

And this project is relatively small, the Halcyon color gamp kit, and meant for learning more than anything serious (not that learning isn't serious).

 

Thanks again,

Jeff

Sat, 07/27/2013 - 23:40

sandra.eberhar…

I have a large countermarche loom with a hanging beater.   I added bungee cord to mine to hold the beater back closer to the heddles, giving me a larger shed.  I was beaten up pretty badly here for doing that; one individual told me that my loom  had "training wheels on it"   I find the motion of pushing the beater, throwing the shuttle and catching it clumsy and wasted motion.   I find the idea that you should just get used to doing this along the line of the guy who said he felt a lot better since he put carpet on  his walls; it hurt less when he banged  his head on the wall.  He could just stop banging his head.  I find bungee cords work very well, and suggest them to any one who's beater isn't hanging just where you would like it.  They don't change the  effort needed to beat.

Sun, 07/28/2013 - 09:03

ReedGuy

I guess it all depends on whether you have a shed open enough on a particular project, due to # of shafts and restricted by beat angle, which will determine if you can use all positions. If you have to swing higher toward the beater to meet the fell and to pass the shuttle clear than that position is probably not right.The further you get from the shafts the shed opening begins to close in.

Maybe Sara has something further.

Bigwhites I see your bungees as a weaving aid for yourself. Who cares what they look like. ;)

 

Mon, 07/29/2013 - 21:56

sandra.eberhar…

Exactly my feeling!  The Lervad beater hangs straight down close to the harnesses.  The big barn frame has different geometry, and needs the assist.

Tue, 07/30/2013 - 00:14

Sara von Tresckow

If the weaver does not make extreme demands on shed height, the use of bungees is interesting, but not always productive. While they may bring the beater back on its own, the pull forward will take more energy - the amount of motion and force needed to weave will be about the same either way.

Over time, you develop the motions needed to work the beater with out any assisting devices, it becomes automatic to push on the beater before throwing a pick - in my case, I lean on the beater as part of the motion - it steadies my upper body in a way that letting go and having the bungees kick in would interrupt.

It is important to know that where the beater "hangs" when at rest has little to do with the actual motions of weaving - what matters is what kind of shed is forming when you push on the beater in anticipation of putting the shuttle through. (Or where the beater is being held if bungees are part of the equation.)

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