Anyone have experience with collapse weaves? 

Comments

Fri, 06/26/2009 - 16:31

ingamarie

Actually what I meant is more weaving with overtwisted yarns, or steel/silk yarns.. that sort of thing.

Sat, 06/27/2009 - 01:29

Caroline (not verified)

I've seen articles in Handwoven, and have the Anne Field book but haven't tried it yet - its very intriguing! and as a spinner, I'd like to be able to predict how my singles will re-act so I can use them to good effect. There have been articles in Spin-Off too, about using energised singles, for knitting socks I think, as basically the yarn is unbalanced and requires a slight modification to the way you knit to stop everything leaning in one direction.

Simply put, yarn needs to be balanced to keep the fabric straight once its washed, so you ply 2 singles together, which removes half the twist ( in a perfect spinner's world)  to balance it. However there are many weavers and knitters successfully using singles without their fabrics collapsing as there are techniques to overcome the strength of the unplied yarn.

The effects in woven fabric are amazing, and you don't need anything more than a rigid heddle loom to take advantage of this technique.

Sat, 06/27/2009 - 20:55

ingamarie

I have the Anne Field book and also one in Danish by Lotte Dalgaard. I'm dreaming of going to Sweden this fall and taking a class from her :)  I just put a steel/silk Habu warp on my rigid heddle loom last night.  I'm working up to doing it on the big loom, but thought I'd start here and get my bearings.  I'll put some pictures up of that adventure when there's something to see.

Sun, 06/28/2009 - 04:54

Caroline (not verified)

Ooooh! Can you put me in your suitcase please? I'm only little! That sounds sooooooo interesting! I look forward to seeing the photos of how you go.

I'm busy making spindles at the moment - oiling wood, which is messy and smells, so its not really the ideal time to weave!

Fri, 07/03/2009 - 01:19

ingamarie

Yea, well we'll see if I go :)  If I do rest assured there will be pictures...

Making spindles, hm. Sound like fun. And the pictures of those are-----

marie

Tue, 07/07/2009 - 23:44

dteaj (not verified)

 

 

Hi Marie,

I've done one scarf so far with overtwist handspun wool weft. The warp was 60/2 bombyx doubled in the heddles with varying setts in plain weave and 2/2 twill. The ends had 1/2 inch of stainless steel/wool to poof them out. It collapsed about 60% in width, 12% in length. I'm quite pleased with it, but haven't put it up in my projects yet.

I've also tested linen, wool/stainless steel, and silk. Silk seems to require a great deal of twist to do anything more than slight undulations. I've done a needlewoven sample with wool/stainless which seems to do nothing much on that scale.

I do love Lotte Dalgaard's work. Would you mind filling me in a little? Does she say anything specific about working with linen? I've done a couple of samples with overtwisted linen, which were not impressive. Not much collapse, but extra twist caused worming. Also, does she mention anything about beetling the linen. Linen is a little harsh without it, even without extra twist...

Debbie

 
Wed, 07/08/2009 - 22:32

ingamarie

I can look. Danish isn't my language-- Swedish is, and it's close but requires a bit of concentration for me to work through..

What do you mean by beetling? and what do you mean byt the 1/2 inch of stainless steel/wool to poof them out? :)

I'll check through Lotte's book and let you know. It's really a very cool book.

marie

Thu, 07/09/2009 - 15:39

dteaj (not verified)

Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize it would be a tough read. Please don't go to the trouble if it's too much.

You probably know beetling as mangling. It's usually done to linen cloth after weaving and wet finishing to press the linen fibers flater and increase shine and drape.

I used stainless steel/wool yarn available from Habu Textiles as weft, densely beaten for 1/2 inch, at the beginning and end. The stiffness of the stainless steel at that density of picks per inch forces the collapse out into a ruffle.

 

Thu, 07/09/2009 - 17:34

ea_mather (not verified)

I found a collapse-weave scarf project in Handwoven Sept/Oct 2004 and was able to still order the yarn kit for it from Heritage Spinning & Weaving 47 E. Flint ST Lake Orion, MI 48362 (248) 693-3690 - Fax: 248-920-0451 www.heritagespinning.com

I have the yarn now and as soon as I get my current project finished, I intend to start this one.

-Liz

Wed, 07/15/2009 - 21:13

ingamarie

Oh wow. That's cool.

I have that same yarn on a rigid heddle loom right now, I'm trying to keep it at 12 epi... it's hard. We'll see what happens :)

marie

Wed, 07/15/2009 - 21:43

laurafry

Hi Marie,

There is one collapse weave project in Magic in the Water - project 19 as I recall.

Cheers,

Laura

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:07

dteaj (not verified)

Just put up in my projects the collapse scarf described in a previous message.

I'm currently putting another collapse with Habu wool overtwist warp on the loom. Keep your fingers crossed!

Marie, how is your silk/steel coming?

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:13

dteaj (not verified)

Laura, would you mind describing what did your collapse project consisted of?  Magic in the Water is in our guild library and I've definitely looked through it without noticing that particular project. Unfortunately our guild library is closed over the summer. :-(

BTW, a big thank you to you for producing Magic! It's really influenced how I finish cloth.

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:19

ingamarie

It's still on the little loom, but should be done soon. Hard to tell from here :)

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:21

laurafry

The project is numbere 19 - the warp is 20/2 merc. cotton in two blocks of twill.  One block was woven in stripes of 1:3 twill, the other stripe was woven in 3:1 twill.  The weft was an extremely fine singles wool with a lot of active twist in it.

I sell the high twist wool on my Art Fire store http://LauraFry.artfire.com

I also sell a wool/lycra combination in a very fine grist.

Cheers,

Laura

just home from Missouri with a summer cold.........   :P~

Wed, 09/23/2009 - 13:02

msthimble

hi all

debbie thea idea of using the habu stainless to crete a ruffle is so clever.  laura i didnt know that magic has projects in it too i thought it was a finishing study only- i want to borrow from my guild library too

Wed, 09/23/2009 - 22:17

ingamarie

Well let's just say that now and then something doesn't work out so well :) which is ok.  It's a sad little thing. It would be quite nice in something other than black (or midnight) and if it was bigger. But it looks a little like a widow's veil that got left out in the rain. But I have to remind myself that I was mostly trying to see how the material worked and it's, um, a learning experience.....

Sun, 10/04/2009 - 22:42

dteaj (not verified)

 

Um, Marie. I'd love to see it, even if you're not crazy about it. I agree that that's how we learn.

What came out nicely about it? Was it the texture? I promise to post something that didn't work for me in exchange. :-)

 
Sun, 10/04/2009 - 23:07

ingamarie

Let's see. It will make a good Halloween piece. Stay tuned...

marie

 

Tue, 10/06/2009 - 15:11

dteaj (not verified)

OK. As a show of good faith, here's one that didn't work for me. It is collapse, although not of unusual materials. I was fascinated by Lotte Dalgaard's use of linen in collapse, so I decided to try one. It is basically gauze windowpanes of linen singles with a wool/silk frame. It was supposed to full and have loose linen puffs.

Here's a closeup on the loom:

 

Here are the samples, mangled and fulled:

I used a couple of different yarns and was checking out ways of finishing the ends of the scarf. The all linen grid I used for the scarf is on the left, left row. As you can see, one sample came out with the puffs relatively intact, the other was much more scattered. Maybe it is the difference in the amount of fulling or mangling. I'm not sure.

 

Here's the final product:

 

As you can see, even with the fulling wool to hold down the screen, it is very flimsy and sloppy. Without the mangling, it is too stiff. With the mangling, it is too floppy. Also, the linen singles do have some twist energy and given enough room and enough softening of the fibers, will show some of it. :-(

Anyway, not my best effort. I'm thinking of trying a new version with a similar fine wool frame, but using a less partially felting interior yarn such as a fine kid mohair or a long wool yarn.

Tue, 10/06/2009 - 16:18

ingamarie

Not nearly as bad as mine. I"ll get a picture up soon. :)

Thu, 10/08/2009 - 15:26

ingamarie

OK then, here it is. I"m calling it 'Black Widow' and bringing it to my Guild's weaving horror stories program tonight :)

What I did was put it on a rigid heddle loom, but with a skipped slot/hole and then I tried to mimic that open grid in the beat. I was hard to control the selvages on the RH.

I also think either bigger or not black, or both,  would have helped... something that looked more ethereal and less funereal!

Oh well, like we say around here-- it's an  experiment, it may not work.

marie

Black Widow 1Black Widow 3Black Widow 2Black Widow 4

Sun, 10/11/2009 - 19:00

dteaj (not verified)

Thanks so much for posting this.

Well, I see what you mean, but it would fit a New York City sensibility pretty well. They dress a lot in black and it seems like it would be all in how you wore it. With neutrals or near neutrals and a pop of bright color, it could work pretty well.

Why is the upper right hand image so different from the others? Is that after washing or before ironing or what???

By the way, I found Lotte Dalgaard's book on the web. She has a CD with an English translation to go with the book. I've ordered them from Lotte and they are on their way to me right now. I am very excited!

Sun, 10/11/2009 - 19:25

ingamarie

Yea with the right thing it would be ok, but most things are like that aren't they.  Also if it was bigger.  But I have to remind myslef that I was mostly curious how the material worked, not so concerned about what it would be.

All my images area lined up in a vertical row, but you're probably referring to the second one. That's just scrumpled up in a wad.  Since it's steel it will keep whatever shape you give it. And that's actually pretty cool.

Glad you found Lotte's book. I guess I'll keep slogging along with the Danish. Good exercise!

marie

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 18:07

crosstownshuttler (not verified)

Hi Debbie,

I just joined this group and I'm very glad I found it. I'm organizing a Yarn Tasting for my weaving guild in March so members can try out lots of new fibers without having to spend a lot of money before we find some we really like - horsehair, wool/stainless, over-twist yarn, etc.  I will put this link in the handouts.

Thank you for posting your project. I like the idea. I wonder if it might have held together better if the squares were smaller?

I'm also the guild librarian. We have Anne Field's book and I'm interested in Lotte Dalgaard's book with english translation but I can't find it on the internet. Could you post a link please?

TIA,

Carie

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 20:34

ingamarie

HI,

Thanks for the feedback, I just came back this weekend from a Collapse Weave workshop our guild had. It was hugely fun, and I"ll post pictures as soon as I get it done. Giovanna Imperia taught it and she has the Dalgaard book (which is fabulous). She has an ad in the marketplace of Weavolution, check there for the link (and help Wlution out a little to :)  )  That link is http://www.weavolution.com/marketplace

And thanks for the yarn tasting idea.. we may have to do that :)

marie

 

 

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 20:57

dteaj (not verified)

In terms of the project, I've since sampled with the linen sett and woven more closely and that works better.

Giovanna Imperia mentioned in a yahoo post recently that she has some copies of the Dalgaard book. Her contact is

Email: [email protected];  [email protected]

Phone:

832-455-4269

 

In case she doesn't have any left, you can order directly from Lotte via email using Paypal. That's how I ordered it.

[email protected]

Good luck. This stuff is so much fun!

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 20:57

dteaj (not verified)

In terms of the project, I've since sampled with the linen sett and woven more closely and that works better.

Giovanna Imperia mentioned in a yahoo post recently that she has some copies of the Dalgaard book. Her contact is

Email: [email protected];  [email protected]

Phone:

832-455-4269

 

In case she doesn't have any left, you can order directly from Lotte via email using Paypal. That's how I ordered it.

[email protected]

Good luck. This stuff is so much fun!

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 21:01

dteaj (not verified)

Oh, I just notice you posted this. Great idea to send her through Weavolution to get to Giovanna.

Oooh! I am so jealous!  What did Giovanna cover?

Wed, 01/27/2010 - 21:57

ingamarie

We warped inch wide sections of linen with half inch sections of active yarn in between and then played with different active yarns. It's still on the loom, but looks like there are some cool effects in there.  I'll post in the next few days.

 

Wed, 02/03/2010 - 15:59

ingamarie

Hey there-- I'm looking to try some of Lotte Dalgaards ideas-- she uses 17,000 m/kg linen singles in her work. Any idea where to get that in colors in the US-- Bockens has 28/1 which is roughly the same but not in colors.   Any ideas?

 

Tue, 02/09/2010 - 19:13

dteaj (not verified)

I've been looking, but haven't found any sources. I'm using natural colors for now and waiting for my dye space to thaw out this spring. :-)

Habu's 100/1 linen is to die for, by the way.  I've been using it as weft with undegummed organzine as a warp, along with some other fine yarns.  I'll try to post a picture of the sample in the next few days.

Fri, 06/26/2009 - 16:31

ingamarie

Actually what I meant is more weaving with overtwisted yarns, or steel/silk yarns.. that sort of thing.

Sat, 06/27/2009 - 01:29

Caroline (not verified)

I've seen articles in Handwoven, and have the Anne Field book but haven't tried it yet - its very intriguing! and as a spinner, I'd like to be able to predict how my singles will re-act so I can use them to good effect. There have been articles in Spin-Off too, about using energised singles, for knitting socks I think, as basically the yarn is unbalanced and requires a slight modification to the way you knit to stop everything leaning in one direction.

Simply put, yarn needs to be balanced to keep the fabric straight once its washed, so you ply 2 singles together, which removes half the twist ( in a perfect spinner's world)  to balance it. However there are many weavers and knitters successfully using singles without their fabrics collapsing as there are techniques to overcome the strength of the unplied yarn.

The effects in woven fabric are amazing, and you don't need anything more than a rigid heddle loom to take advantage of this technique.

Sat, 06/27/2009 - 20:55

ingamarie

I have the Anne Field book and also one in Danish by Lotte Dalgaard. I'm dreaming of going to Sweden this fall and taking a class from her :)  I just put a steel/silk Habu warp on my rigid heddle loom last night.  I'm working up to doing it on the big loom, but thought I'd start here and get my bearings.  I'll put some pictures up of that adventure when there's something to see.

Sun, 06/28/2009 - 04:54

Caroline (not verified)

Ooooh! Can you put me in your suitcase please? I'm only little! That sounds sooooooo interesting! I look forward to seeing the photos of how you go.

I'm busy making spindles at the moment - oiling wood, which is messy and smells, so its not really the ideal time to weave!

Fri, 07/03/2009 - 01:19

ingamarie

Yea, well we'll see if I go :)  If I do rest assured there will be pictures...

Making spindles, hm. Sound like fun. And the pictures of those are-----

marie

Tue, 07/07/2009 - 23:44

dteaj (not verified)

 

 

Hi Marie,

I've done one scarf so far with overtwist handspun wool weft. The warp was 60/2 bombyx doubled in the heddles with varying setts in plain weave and 2/2 twill. The ends had 1/2 inch of stainless steel/wool to poof them out. It collapsed about 60% in width, 12% in length. I'm quite pleased with it, but haven't put it up in my projects yet.

I've also tested linen, wool/stainless steel, and silk. Silk seems to require a great deal of twist to do anything more than slight undulations. I've done a needlewoven sample with wool/stainless which seems to do nothing much on that scale.

I do love Lotte Dalgaard's work. Would you mind filling me in a little? Does she say anything specific about working with linen? I've done a couple of samples with overtwisted linen, which were not impressive. Not much collapse, but extra twist caused worming. Also, does she mention anything about beetling the linen. Linen is a little harsh without it, even without extra twist...

Debbie

 
Wed, 07/08/2009 - 22:32

ingamarie

I can look. Danish isn't my language-- Swedish is, and it's close but requires a bit of concentration for me to work through..

What do you mean by beetling? and what do you mean byt the 1/2 inch of stainless steel/wool to poof them out? :)

I'll check through Lotte's book and let you know. It's really a very cool book.

marie

Thu, 07/09/2009 - 15:39

dteaj (not verified)

Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize it would be a tough read. Please don't go to the trouble if it's too much.

You probably know beetling as mangling. It's usually done to linen cloth after weaving and wet finishing to press the linen fibers flater and increase shine and drape.

I used stainless steel/wool yarn available from Habu Textiles as weft, densely beaten for 1/2 inch, at the beginning and end. The stiffness of the stainless steel at that density of picks per inch forces the collapse out into a ruffle.

 

Thu, 07/09/2009 - 17:34

ea_mather (not verified)

I found a collapse-weave scarf project in Handwoven Sept/Oct 2004 and was able to still order the yarn kit for it from Heritage Spinning & Weaving 47 E. Flint ST Lake Orion, MI 48362 (248) 693-3690 - Fax: 248-920-0451 www.heritagespinning.com

I have the yarn now and as soon as I get my current project finished, I intend to start this one.

-Liz

Wed, 07/15/2009 - 21:13

ingamarie

Oh wow. That's cool.

I have that same yarn on a rigid heddle loom right now, I'm trying to keep it at 12 epi... it's hard. We'll see what happens :)

marie

Wed, 07/15/2009 - 21:43

laurafry

Hi Marie,

There is one collapse weave project in Magic in the Water - project 19 as I recall.

Cheers,

Laura

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:07

dteaj (not verified)

Just put up in my projects the collapse scarf described in a previous message.

I'm currently putting another collapse with Habu wool overtwist warp on the loom. Keep your fingers crossed!

Marie, how is your silk/steel coming?

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:13

dteaj (not verified)

Laura, would you mind describing what did your collapse project consisted of?  Magic in the Water is in our guild library and I've definitely looked through it without noticing that particular project. Unfortunately our guild library is closed over the summer. :-(

BTW, a big thank you to you for producing Magic! It's really influenced how I finish cloth.

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:19

ingamarie

It's still on the little loom, but should be done soon. Hard to tell from here :)

Tue, 07/21/2009 - 16:21

laurafry

The project is numbere 19 - the warp is 20/2 merc. cotton in two blocks of twill.  One block was woven in stripes of 1:3 twill, the other stripe was woven in 3:1 twill.  The weft was an extremely fine singles wool with a lot of active twist in it.

I sell the high twist wool on my Art Fire store http://LauraFry.artfire.com

I also sell a wool/lycra combination in a very fine grist.

Cheers,

Laura

just home from Missouri with a summer cold.........   :P~

Wed, 09/23/2009 - 13:02

msthimble

hi all

debbie thea idea of using the habu stainless to crete a ruffle is so clever.  laura i didnt know that magic has projects in it too i thought it was a finishing study only- i want to borrow from my guild library too

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